"Where is community spirit?" Hereford daugher "disgusted" by lack of help given to elderly mother

"Where is the community spirit?" Hereford daughter "disgusted" by lack of help given to elderly mother stuck in flood

Claire's mother was stranded alone in flood water for almost two and a half hours. Photo by Emma James.

Firefighters helping to rescue Claire's elderly mother from flood water. Photo by Emma James. (3415128)

First published in News
Last updated
by , Reporter

A HEREFORD woman is asking where community spirit has gone after her 73-year-old mother was stranded alone in flood water for more than two hours.

The Hereford Times reported online that firefighters rescued a woman and her pet dog from flood water near Bodenham last Friday.

But Claire James, daughter of the woman says she has been left “disgusted” by the lack of help given to her mother before emergency services arrived.

“I couldn’t believe the callous way that people driving by didn’t stop and wouldn’t stop to help,” she said.

“The point is that mum is quite a sensible person and when she came to the flood she knew she had to reverse out but a car behind overtook at such a speed that the water lapped up and pulled the car in.

"As drivers continued through the water, it created a wave effect which took mum further. This happened five times before we got there."

Claire added that just one person stopped to ask if they could help.

Her mum was on her way to pick up a prescription for her diabetes when she became stuck in the water.

She also had her pet dog – a 10-year-old dachshund which has heart problems – with her and called her daughter for help from her mobile phone.

Fire crews from Bromyard and Leominster came to aid of the pair and water ‘first-responders’ from Bromyard attended with specialist lines and floats to perform the rescue.

An ambulance was also called and Claire's mother was checked over at the scene before returning home.

Claire added: "If she didn’t have a mobile phone system I dread to think what would’ve happened. It really saddens me and could’ve been much worse.”

Both Claire and her mother thanked the emergency services for their help.

Comments (26)

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6:24pm Tue 14 Jan 14

Herefordboy says...

Reversing out of a flood is the worst thing you can do once you are in it.Other cars were obviously going throught this "flood" so it sounds like this problem was of her own making.Also she says one person stopped to ask her iif she was ok,so how many people does she want to stop?
Reversing out of a flood is the worst thing you can do once you are in it.Other cars were obviously going throught this "flood" so it sounds like this problem was of her own making.Also she says one person stopped to ask her iif she was ok,so how many people does she want to stop? Herefordboy
  • Score: 21

7:57pm Tue 14 Jan 14

biggieandmushy says...

I live very near to this lane and it always floods after a few days of rain as there is a stream/ brook runningalong side part of it. I'm sorry to say that the road had signs up prev stating road closed but cannot comment whether they were still there that time of day although I went down the road at two thirty in afternoon and signs were there. I don't want to cause offence to driver or family but most of community know not to travel that lane due to weather we have had recently. It's also not a busy lane either, the driver could have gone in the opposite direction and it would have taken her to the A49 which was flood free.
I live very near to this lane and it always floods after a few days of rain as there is a stream/ brook runningalong side part of it. I'm sorry to say that the road had signs up prev stating road closed but cannot comment whether they were still there that time of day although I went down the road at two thirty in afternoon and signs were there. I don't want to cause offence to driver or family but most of community know not to travel that lane due to weather we have had recently. It's also not a busy lane either, the driver could have gone in the opposite direction and it would have taken her to the A49 which was flood free. biggieandmushy
  • Score: 18

8:15pm Tue 14 Jan 14

mizza21 says...

She's an old lady you miserable s0ds!
With a poorly dog with a heart condition in the car with her !

People should have stopped to help her. She could have got washed away by the floods.
She's an old lady you miserable s0ds! With a poorly dog with a heart condition in the car with her ! People should have stopped to help her. She could have got washed away by the floods. mizza21
  • Score: 3

9:43pm Tue 14 Jan 14

xantiaman says...

She is 73 for godsake Herefordboy idiot,wait to your 73,biggieandmushy,so was it flooded at 14-30hrs when you went along it?if it was why did you not go in the opposite direction back to the A49, like the comment you posted,have you never ever broken down? Think what it must have been like for the lady !. It is not rocket science,you stop,if you have no wellington boots,you use your bare feet to push the ladys car out of the flood or if like you,you can use your iphone 5 and phone 101,or GO to Saffrons Cross Garage and alert them to the fact there was a lady stuck in the flood where you obviously live.
She is 73 for godsake Herefordboy idiot,wait to your 73,biggieandmushy,so was it flooded at 14-30hrs when you went along it?if it was why did you not go in the opposite direction back to the A49, like the comment you posted,have you never ever broken down? Think what it must have been like for the lady !. It is not rocket science,you stop,if you have no wellington boots,you use your bare feet to push the ladys car out of the flood or if like you,you can use your iphone 5 and phone 101,or GO to Saffrons Cross Garage and alert them to the fact there was a lady stuck in the flood where you obviously live. xantiaman
  • Score: 2

10:06pm Tue 14 Jan 14

xantiaman says...

Claire if your reading this,my sympathy goes out to your Mother and you and your family,its the society that we live in i'm affraid ! people that only think of themselves !,i'm all right jack and they could'nt give a toss,untill it happens to them.
Claire if your reading this,my sympathy goes out to your Mother and you and your family,its the society that we live in i'm affraid ! people that only think of themselves !,i'm all right jack and they could'nt give a toss,untill it happens to them. xantiaman
  • Score: 5

10:44pm Tue 14 Jan 14

FergOfTheFord says...

Or maybe the daughter of the 73 year old diabetic mother, having listened to or read the numerous local flood warnings, should have contacted her mother and offered to collect the prescription for her??
Or maybe the daughter of the 73 year old diabetic mother, having listened to or read the numerous local flood warnings, should have contacted her mother and offered to collect the prescription for her?? FergOfTheFord
  • Score: 31

11:10pm Tue 14 Jan 14

bobby47 says...

Don't despair Claire, there are many, many fine and good people about who would have stopped to help your Mother. They simply didn't drive past your Mother at that particular time and abandoned her to panick alone.
There are also many fine bloggers about who fully understand your concerns and have nothing in common with those bloggers who mock and pour scorn on your thoroughly worthwhile point, that is, to many people can no longer be bothered to extend a hand if kindness.
My very warmest regards.
Don't despair Claire, there are many, many fine and good people about who would have stopped to help your Mother. They simply didn't drive past your Mother at that particular time and abandoned her to panick alone. There are also many fine bloggers about who fully understand your concerns and have nothing in common with those bloggers who mock and pour scorn on your thoroughly worthwhile point, that is, to many people can no longer be bothered to extend a hand if kindness. My very warmest regards. bobby47
  • Score: 7

11:26pm Tue 14 Jan 14

biggieandmushy says...

xantiaman wrote:
She is 73 for godsake Herefordboy idiot,wait to your 73,biggieandmushy,so was it flooded at 14-30hrs when you went along it?if it was why did you not go in the opposite direction back to the A49, like the comment you posted,have you never ever broken down? Think what it must have been like for the lady !. It is not rocket science,you stop,if you have no wellington boots,you use your bare feet to push the ladys car out of the flood or if like you,you can use your iphone 5 and phone 101,or GO to Saffrons Cross Garage and alert them to the fact there was a lady stuck in the flood where you obviously live.
Yes it was with road closed signs although the signs aren't on the lane until you near the flood, so yes I did turn around and continue along the a49, it was also flooded the three days previous too with road closed signs. You are also correct in the fact that yes its not rocket science to drive into a flood either. I'm sorry if I cause offence but as a driver you have to take into consideration the road and weather conditions if you are incapable of doing this you should not be driving. And no I have never broken down in the years of my driving as I always take into consideration of conditions that I have to drive in also condition of my vehicle.
[quote][p][bold]xantiaman[/bold] wrote: She is 73 for godsake Herefordboy idiot,wait to your 73,biggieandmushy,so was it flooded at 14-30hrs when you went along it?if it was why did you not go in the opposite direction back to the A49, like the comment you posted,have you never ever broken down? Think what it must have been like for the lady !. It is not rocket science,you stop,if you have no wellington boots,you use your bare feet to push the ladys car out of the flood or if like you,you can use your iphone 5 and phone 101,or GO to Saffrons Cross Garage and alert them to the fact there was a lady stuck in the flood where you obviously live.[/p][/quote]Yes it was with road closed signs although the signs aren't on the lane until you near the flood, so yes I did turn around and continue along the a49, it was also flooded the three days previous too with road closed signs. You are also correct in the fact that yes its not rocket science to drive into a flood either. I'm sorry if I cause offence but as a driver you have to take into consideration the road and weather conditions if you are incapable of doing this you should not be driving. And no I have never broken down in the years of my driving as I always take into consideration of conditions that I have to drive in also condition of my vehicle. biggieandmushy
  • Score: 15

11:35pm Tue 14 Jan 14

biggieandmushy says...

With regards to helping the lady, if I was there at that time of course I would have helped her. I am only stating the condition of the lane that days that I went. It is appalling that people just drove past but to state that community spirit was lost is unfair to the actual community. Who knows who the drivers were that past? There are no immediate houses nearby although there are a few further on the lane to have seen her stuck to help. There are always two sides to a story which I am willing to see without judging others who were there or not to help.
With regards to helping the lady, if I was there at that time of course I would have helped her. I am only stating the condition of the lane that days that I went. It is appalling that people just drove past but to state that community spirit was lost is unfair to the actual community. Who knows who the drivers were that past? There are no immediate houses nearby although there are a few further on the lane to have seen her stuck to help. There are always two sides to a story which I am willing to see without judging others who were there or not to help. biggieandmushy
  • Score: 8

7:52am Wed 15 Jan 14

denon says...

There are some horrid people in Herefordshire and some write comments on here
There are some horrid people in Herefordshire and some write comments on here denon
  • Score: -1

9:18am Wed 15 Jan 14

Wellymitts says...

People just don't want to get involved I think....I got thrown from a young horse 18 months ago on a village lane. i was with a friend who grabbed the horse but as i lay face down with a clearly broken leg,broken collar bone and my hat cracked open 3 cars drove by. No one stopped to help.....My poor friend had to try and hold 2 horses whilst ringing 999. My motto in life has always been never to walk by if someone needs help but thats just me.
People just don't want to get involved I think....I got thrown from a young horse 18 months ago on a village lane. i was with a friend who grabbed the horse but as i lay face down with a clearly broken leg,broken collar bone and my hat cracked open 3 cars drove by. No one stopped to help.....My poor friend had to try and hold 2 horses whilst ringing 999. My motto in life has always been never to walk by if someone needs help but thats just me. Wellymitts
  • Score: 10

12:18pm Wed 15 Jan 14

Herefordboy says...

xantiamn,I dont intend to get into a long discussion with somebody whose opening line is to start calling people names,that is a sign of an unintelligent person.If I was passing this lady I would most certainly have stopped,what I was saying was ,like bigand mushy, that drivers of any age have to have some responsibility when they get ino these situations. The daughter says in the time that her mother was stuck,5 cars went past and one stopped,in this sad day and age I would say that is quite good so is hardly representative of Hereford people per se. I guarantee that in London it would be a lot worse.Also she claims that the water picked her mothers car up and carried it away and yet other cars were still driving throught it successfully.I think there is a bit of dramatic license being used here.
xantiamn,I dont intend to get into a long discussion with somebody whose opening line is to start calling people names,that is a sign of an unintelligent person.If I was passing this lady I would most certainly have stopped,what I was saying was ,like bigand mushy, that drivers of any age have to have some responsibility when they get ino these situations. The daughter says in the time that her mother was stuck,5 cars went past and one stopped,in this sad day and age I would say that is quite good so is hardly representative of Hereford people per se. I guarantee that in London it would be a lot worse.Also she claims that the water picked her mothers car up and carried it away and yet other cars were still driving throught it successfully.I think there is a bit of dramatic license being used here. Herefordboy
  • Score: 14

4:13pm Wed 15 Jan 14

William Rudd says...

bobby47 wrote:
Don't despair Claire, there are many, many fine and good people about who would have stopped to help your Mother. They simply didn't drive past your Mother at that particular time and abandoned her to panick alone.
There are also many fine bloggers about who fully understand your concerns and have nothing in common with those bloggers who mock and pour scorn on your thoroughly worthwhile point, that is, to many people can no longer be bothered to extend a hand if kindness.
My very warmest regards.
Well said Bobby
[quote][p][bold]bobby47[/bold] wrote: Don't despair Claire, there are many, many fine and good people about who would have stopped to help your Mother. They simply didn't drive past your Mother at that particular time and abandoned her to panick alone. There are also many fine bloggers about who fully understand your concerns and have nothing in common with those bloggers who mock and pour scorn on your thoroughly worthwhile point, that is, to many people can no longer be bothered to extend a hand if kindness. My very warmest regards.[/p][/quote]Well said Bobby William Rudd
  • Score: -10

8:24pm Wed 15 Jan 14

localcider says...

Herefordboy: I can't help but agree with you. if you chance driving through floods whether or not you can see the end of the expanse of water then there's a possibility you'll come unstuck. I doubt very mch that the 'waves' from passing cars would cause the marooned vehicle to 'float' into deeper water. Being in control of a vehicle comes with responsibility. One driver stopped - what were they told/asked? Yes others went on by but it is unfair to judge the whole community. On the other hand most of us have done daft things. On Christmas Day a family was walking their donkey in the area and as they approached the flood they kept walking. The donkey, which was walking free with no rein/rope stepped over the wall into the brook, clearly not realising the water was more than 6 feet deep. Luckily it bobbed to the surface, scrambled out and several locals (who I think had been in the middle of their dinner) got it out of the field.
Herefordboy: I can't help but agree with you. if you chance driving through floods whether or not you can see the end of the expanse of water then there's a possibility you'll come unstuck. I doubt very mch that the 'waves' from passing cars would cause the marooned vehicle to 'float' into deeper water. Being in control of a vehicle comes with responsibility. One driver stopped - what were they told/asked? Yes others went on by but it is unfair to judge the whole community. On the other hand most of us have done daft things. On Christmas Day a family was walking their donkey in the area and as they approached the flood they kept walking. The donkey, which was walking free with no rein/rope stepped over the wall into the brook, clearly not realising the water was more than 6 feet deep. Luckily it bobbed to the surface, scrambled out and several locals (who I think had been in the middle of their dinner) got it out of the field. localcider
  • Score: 2

11:41am Thu 16 Jan 14

probono says...

We have grown into a society where we fear offering help to people. When did you last pick up a hitchhiker who has missed there bus, pick up a toddler fallen over in the street, take someone's arm to help them over the road ? We fear backlash, , health and safety issues when we try to help, in this day and age, and it seems our Good Smaritan deeds are getting fewer.

I feel sorry about this, but when you get a mouthful from someone you offer a hand to who has fallen, you have to steel yourself to do it again. What a sad society we have become.
We have grown into a society where we fear offering help to people. When did you last pick up a hitchhiker who has missed there bus, pick up a toddler fallen over in the street, take someone's arm to help them over the road ? We fear backlash, , health and safety issues when we try to help, in this day and age, and it seems our Good Smaritan deeds are getting fewer. I feel sorry about this, but when you get a mouthful from someone you offer a hand to who has fallen, you have to steel yourself to do it again. What a sad society we have become. probono
  • Score: 19

8:23pm Thu 16 Jan 14

localcider says...

..and when I said we do daft things, I didn't mean the donkey, which should have had some sort of rope or rein to stop it going where it shouldn't. Adding to probono's comment, yes, it can be scary offering help as you can be met with some hostility, as at times people are ashamed or embarassed at being caught on the back foot because of a predicament they've got themselves into..I don't think the lady in the car would have been nasty to any helpers, but we do live in times whre 'the blame culture' is prevalent...
..and when I said we do daft things, I didn't mean the donkey, which should have had some sort of rope or rein to stop it going where it shouldn't. Adding to probono's comment, yes, it can be scary offering help as you can be met with some hostility, as at times people are ashamed or embarassed at being caught on the back foot because of a predicament they've got themselves into..I don't think the lady in the car would have been nasty to any helpers, but we do live in times whre 'the blame culture' is prevalent... localcider
  • Score: 6

8:43pm Thu 16 Jan 14

diduknow says...

interesting reading all the above comments, its funny what people have to say when they dont know the whole story......
At the time the lady in the car drove that way there were no warning signs.
The cars that came by were being informed about the flood and the stuck car and advised to turn back. The only person who asked if they could help was a lady in a low car which would put her in the same situation as the lady in the flood. The cars that insisted on going through were four by fours. They went through causing a tidal effect which did infact lift the car which I witnessed. The fire crew etc were very helpful as always even they asked a the owner of a large 4by4 with tow bar if they would help to which they were declined!
I can understand some of the comments made, but having wittnessed what happened it was by no way the fault of the dear lady in the car, the weather caught her and more after her out.
interesting reading all the above comments, its funny what people have to say when they dont know the whole story...... At the time the lady in the car drove that way there were no warning signs. The cars that came by were being informed about the flood and the stuck car and advised to turn back. The only person who asked if they could help was a lady in a low car which would put her in the same situation as the lady in the flood. The cars that insisted on going through were four by fours. They went through causing a tidal effect which did infact lift the car which I witnessed. The fire crew etc were very helpful as always even they asked a the owner of a large 4by4 with tow bar if they would help to which they were declined! I can understand some of the comments made, but having wittnessed what happened it was by no way the fault of the dear lady in the car, the weather caught her and more after her out. diduknow
  • Score: 1

1:08pm Fri 17 Jan 14

Houdini80 says...

I really couldn't care less if this comes across as cold but let's not judge other's by name calling 'callous' for a start.

You have no idea of the circumstances of the other drivers. Did your mother verify if they too were elderly? or had children passengers? or perhaps an engine that was prone to failure? Did they have specialist lines to mount a rescue operation? does your Mother have specialist lines to rescue others? And why were cars over taking? 5 cars? at speed? This seems a little odd and besides, when your trying to power through flood you seldom look at other drivers.

So 1 out of 5 cars stopped....if you trust her judgement which to be honest, is a little dubious given her surprise and hesitance at a road that had been flooded for three days, with flood signs. Let's not assume anything and keep the insult's and blame for your 'sensible' Mother.

Whilst on the subject of Sensible? 80mph winds?, tree's uprooted?, the nation flooded? Take the worst route possible, marvelous..........

I think it's a shame that we live in a culture of blame, and an absolute lack of responsibility. It's nobody else's fault and the fact that this is even a story is pathetic. It's also a shame that the wonderful resource of emergency service's were required at the tax payers expense. Just shame the ambulance doesn't carry a cure for ignorance.

In future, don't blame others for both your failures.
I really couldn't care less if this comes across as cold but let's not judge other's by name calling 'callous' for a start. You have no idea of the circumstances of the other drivers. Did your mother verify if they too were elderly? or had children passengers? or perhaps an engine that was prone to failure? Did they have specialist lines to mount a rescue operation? does your Mother have specialist lines to rescue others? And why were cars over taking? 5 cars? at speed? This seems a little odd and besides, when your trying to power through flood you seldom look at other drivers. So 1 out of 5 cars stopped....if you trust her judgement which to be honest, is a little dubious given her surprise and hesitance at a road that had been flooded for three days, with flood signs. Let's not assume anything and keep the insult's and blame for your 'sensible' Mother. Whilst on the subject of Sensible? 80mph winds?, tree's uprooted?, the nation flooded? Take the worst route possible, marvelous.......... I think it's a shame that we live in a culture of blame, and an absolute lack of responsibility. It's nobody else's fault and the fact that this is even a story is pathetic. It's also a shame that the wonderful resource of emergency service's were required at the tax payers expense. Just shame the ambulance doesn't carry a cure for ignorance. In future, don't blame others for both your failures. Houdini80
  • Score: 10

8:30pm Fri 17 Jan 14

RogerLFC says...

If all the other cars were getting through then their wheels were in contact with the road surface. So that stranded car would be in a similar situation. I think it would be very unlikely that it was caused to float further into the flood by a passing car. That said, if I was passing, I would have stopped to help if it appeared assistance was required ...
If all the other cars were getting through then their wheels were in contact with the road surface. So that stranded car would be in a similar situation. I think it would be very unlikely that it was caused to float further into the flood by a passing car. That said, if I was passing, I would have stopped to help if it appeared assistance was required ... RogerLFC
  • Score: 3

12:24pm Sat 18 Jan 14

The Russian 1 says...

When you drive through a puddle, water is pushed out and away from your vehicle. The deeper the water, the higher the speed, the greater the effect. In deep water a 4x4 will create a powerful bow wave that will raise the water level in front of it and push water out, much like a boats bow. Anything in it's way will be lifted and pushed forward. If the lady was trying to reverse out, a bow wave could easily have washed around her car and flooded into the engine. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.
When you drive through a puddle, water is pushed out and away from your vehicle. The deeper the water, the higher the speed, the greater the effect. In deep water a 4x4 will create a powerful bow wave that will raise the water level in front of it and push water out, much like a boats bow. Anything in it's way will be lifted and pushed forward. If the lady was trying to reverse out, a bow wave could easily have washed around her car and flooded into the engine. Hindsight is a wonderful thing. The Russian 1
  • Score: -2

4:49pm Sat 18 Jan 14

richardsharpe15535855 says...

I wouldn't have stopped. If I were to stop at every stationary vehicle I saw it would take me a week to drive anywhere. I've stopped at car crashes and people collapsed on the street including a man who was unconscious on the road in the middle of hereford where people were stepping over him but stop at every car? No. I would have seen the flood water and thought 'is my car a boat? No. I'll turn around and save the fire engines and ambulance for someone who needs them'
I wouldn't have stopped. If I were to stop at every stationary vehicle I saw it would take me a week to drive anywhere. I've stopped at car crashes and people collapsed on the street including a man who was unconscious on the road in the middle of hereford where people were stepping over him but stop at every car? No. I would have seen the flood water and thought 'is my car a boat? No. I'll turn around and save the fire engines and ambulance for someone who needs them' richardsharpe15535855
  • Score: 3

10:43pm Sat 18 Jan 14

mizza21 says...

OMG.. .She was an old lady. Possibly quite frightened.
Alright, she made a mistake going that way... But it's a little miserable to castigate the poor dear for an error.
Why can't we look out for the vulnerable people?
Isn't that what our taxes are for?

I for one have absolutely no problem with this and I'd have stopped to help. I'd even have got me fet wet to make sure whe wasn't on her own in a scary situation.
OMG.. .She was an old lady. Possibly quite frightened. Alright, she made a mistake going that way... But it's a little miserable to castigate the poor dear for an error. Why can't we look out for the vulnerable people? Isn't that what our taxes are for? I for one have absolutely no problem with this and I'd have stopped to help. I'd even have got me fet wet to make sure whe wasn't on her own in a scary situation. mizza21
  • Score: -8

1:51pm Sun 19 Jan 14

Houdini80 says...

OMG...thing is, you didn't, and neither did any of the other self righteous brigade. There is very little merit or credibility in trying to positively enforce your point with a fantasy scenario
OMG...thing is, you didn't, and neither did any of the other self righteous brigade. There is very little merit or credibility in trying to positively enforce your point with a fantasy scenario Houdini80
  • Score: -8

4:32pm Mon 20 Jan 14

mizza21 says...

Never needed the Emergency Services Houdini80 ?
I hope you never do. But if you do I hope nobody judges you quite so harshly as you are prepared to pass judgement on a poor pensioner who paid her taxes all her life.(presumably)
I'm more than happy for the emergency services to be used in this way. Good use of my not insubstantial taxes.
Never needed the Emergency Services Houdini80 ? I hope you never do. But if you do I hope nobody judges you quite so harshly as you are prepared to pass judgement on a poor pensioner who paid her taxes all her life.(presumably) I'm more than happy for the emergency services to be used in this way. Good use of my not insubstantial taxes. mizza21
  • Score: -6

8:41pm Mon 20 Jan 14

Houdini80 says...

Again, from fantasy scenario to assumption, this hypothesis has become quite comical. My criticism, as you would have read, was largely a response to the daughter. A daughter who absolves herself and her Mother of a misadventure and attacks the Herefordian community as a whole. That is not acceptable, hence the acerbic response.
Again, from fantasy scenario to assumption, this hypothesis has become quite comical. My criticism, as you would have read, was largely a response to the daughter. A daughter who absolves herself and her Mother of a misadventure and attacks the Herefordian community as a whole. That is not acceptable, hence the acerbic response. Houdini80
  • Score: 12

3:37pm Tue 21 Jan 14

Basedonexperience says...

Yup. Sounds like the toilet of a nowhereplace that we know Hereford to be. Could not be less surprised. Best thing anyone can do is get out of the place as quick as possible and NEVER go back. Poor woman. What a load of cowards and losers to ignore her like that. Ugh. Typical of the imbred self-absorbed mentailty of those farm creatures.
Yup. Sounds like the toilet of a nowhereplace that we know Hereford to be. Could not be less surprised. Best thing anyone can do is get out of the place as quick as possible and NEVER go back. Poor woman. What a load of cowards and losers to ignore her like that. Ugh. Typical of the imbred self-absorbed mentailty of those farm creatures. Basedonexperience
  • Score: -6

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